I sent Dave this colored version of one of the variant covers of the upcoming CEREBUS #2:
He sent these notes:
Next Week: Swords of Cerebus In Hell? Hardcover Kickstarter?!?
23 comments:
Bill Ritter
said...
Nice article; very interesting discussion. Thanks! I am a bit sad I'll miss out on getting this based on my refusal to support Waverly Press due to their Spawn 10 antics. Hope others find their enjoyment.
Hey Sean - I'd love to see those notes! He sent me some of the mark-ups he did for that cover, his hand written notes that he faxed over to you. I only have 5 pages. And that looks like it only covered a bit of that cover. . .Can't wait to see the finished piece.
Dave seems like a pretty tough taskmaster. As a fan, I’ve always loved his work. Not sure I’d ever want him as a boss, though. Definitely a master class in progress here. I wonder if Gerhard endured such extensive critiques back in ‘84 and ‘85? Interesting stuff.
John g., as a college graduate with a B.A. in studio art, I can assure you that Dave is not being too harsh here. These notes are about as routine as they come as far as critiques go.
In graduate school MFA programs in studio art there are weekly defenses where a student’s work is split down to the atoms of the canvas by instructors, and the student has to explain why he made that mark or left a certain passage undone or underdeveloped . Sounds like hyperbole from the outside, but it’s welcomed criticism for serious artists.
Too, the teacher, if he is any good, will offer examples from other artists to show the student what he is talking about and a way towards becoming more competent at the craft. Dave’s allusion to work by Barry Windsor-Smith is an example above.
So, I don’t think Dave is being tough here, but is being very precise about how the color and tone for his character and artwork should be.
Not to imply that either Ben or Sean are students here. They are professional artists and graphic designers. Just wanted to establish the frame of reference through which I perceive Dave’s notes to be coming from here.
Again (previous post), as an art nobody/nothing, I would say 1. bitchslap the artist 2. do anything to fix that "bloated sack of protoplasm" that I think is meant to be the rectus femoris 3. give the poor guy a (right) knee cap, even if it's only a highlight on the quadriceps femoris 4. repeat 1 and 2
Brian W. - Cool. Much respect to you artists out there. I like this kind of behind the scenes “inside baseball” type stuff. Interesting post by Ben H. Cheers!
Everyone reads your posts, Brian - you're about the only civilized person here (well, except Margaret, of course). And as a teacher, I can only wish that more students understood why their work is "criticized" - in the classical sense of the word. (Hint to students: It's because I know you can do better.)
You are doing God’s work, Tony. I absolutely abhorred doing math when I was a student. Knew I needed to become proficient at it enough to earn decent marks in HS and college, but that was it for me.
You’re right about what it’s about. what you read - comics, newspapers, social media, etc. - is what you feed your mind. Comics fall under that dietary regimen.
Benjamin Hobbs:
23 comments:
Nice article; very interesting discussion. Thanks!
I am a bit sad I'll miss out on getting this based on my refusal to support Waverly Press due to their Spawn 10 antics. Hope others find their enjoyment.
Thanks for sharing this with us, Ben!
^ What Dan said.
Great art commentary from Dave. Thanks for posting this.
Hmmm....
Dave says, "Too Dark".
Makes me wonder if perhaps he isn't developing cataracts...
Steve
Here we go again.
If y'all think this is extensive, you should see the notes he sent me for the cover I covered. Whew!
Hey Sean - I'd love to see those notes! He sent me some of the mark-ups he did for that cover, his hand written notes that he faxed over to you. I only have 5 pages. And that looks like it only covered a bit of that cover. . .Can't wait to see the finished piece.
Dave is nothing if not ... thorough.
Dave seems like a pretty tough taskmaster. As a fan, I’ve always loved his work. Not sure I’d ever want him as a boss, though. Definitely a master class in progress here. I wonder if Gerhard endured such extensive critiques back in ‘84 and ‘85? Interesting stuff.
John g., as a college graduate with a B.A. in studio art, I can assure you that Dave is not being too harsh here. These notes are about as routine as they come as far as critiques go.
In graduate school MFA programs in studio art there are weekly defenses where a student’s work is split down to the atoms of the canvas by instructors, and the student has to explain why he made that mark or left a certain passage undone or underdeveloped . Sounds like hyperbole from the outside, but it’s welcomed criticism for serious artists.
Too, the teacher, if he is any good, will offer examples from other artists to show the student what he is talking about and a way towards becoming more competent at the craft. Dave’s allusion to work by Barry Windsor-Smith is an example above.
So, I don’t think Dave is being tough here, but is being very precise about how the color and tone for his character and artwork should be.
Being very precise about how the color, tone, AND value for his artwork and character should be, I should have said.
Not to imply that either Ben or Sean are students here. They are professional artists and graphic designers. Just wanted to establish the frame of reference through which I perceive Dave’s notes to be coming from here.
Again (previous post), as an art nobody/nothing, I would say
1. bitchslap the artist
2. do anything to fix that "bloated sack of protoplasm" that I think is meant to be the rectus femoris
3. give the poor guy a (right) knee cap, even if it's only a highlight on the quadriceps femoris
4. repeat 1 and 2
Correction: that I think is meant to be the combined form of the vastus lateralis and rectus femoris
Brian W. - Cool. Much respect to you artists out there. I like this kind of behind the scenes “inside baseball” type stuff. Interesting post by Ben H. Cheers!
Thank you for reading my post, John g. Cheers.
Brian is spot-on here! And no offense taken.
Everyone reads your posts, Brian - you're about the only civilized person here (well, except Margaret, of course).
And as a teacher, I can only wish that more students understood why their work is "criticized" - in the classical sense of the word. (Hint to students: It's because I know you can do better.)
Thank you for the compliment, Tony. I attribute any civilized behavior on my part to reading comics, a liberal arts education, and my mama.
Might I ask what you teach Tony?
Mathematics, at the college level (but I'm not a professor, as I do not do original research).
And it's all about which comics you read, innit???
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiom
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluid_and_crystallized_intelligence
;)
You are doing God’s work, Tony. I absolutely abhorred doing math when I was a student. Knew I needed to become proficient at it enough to earn decent marks in HS and college, but that was it for me.
You’re right about what it’s about. what you read - comics, newspapers, social media, etc. - is what you feed your mind. Comics fall under that dietary regimen.
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